Drew Williams
Member
I would like to start a thread about the ORIGINAL Citadel Colour paint pots, and the merits of the current Coat d'Arms paint range, which is effectively the same paints in the same old containers.
My hope is that this thread can become an information repository for Oldhammer enthusiasts and the general hobby community.
I am very excited to collect a set of paint pots that match the original range as closely as possible, not only in color, but in consistency, longevity, and even smell. I am ordering several of the colors from the Coat d'Arms range right now, and even creating new old-style "Citadel Colour" pot labels with the original color names on them (Which should tell you how nuts I must be about this topic.).
I UNDERSTAND that other paint ranges could be used to emulate certain colors in the original range, but I'd like this thread to focus on the merits and possibilities within the Coat d'Arms range.
To begin with, I'll include links to some of the most important resources about these colors.
The "Archaeopainting" article posted on the Realm of Chaos blog back in 2012 is a definitive and indispensable introduction to this topic.
http://realmofchaos80s.blogspot.com/2012/09/retro-painting-and-modelling-or.html
Next is the UK business which currently supplies and distributes the original product as relabeled "Coat d'Arms"; Black Hat Miniatures. It is still manufactured by HMG Paints Ltd. in Manchester.
http://www.blackhat.co.uk/product-category/coat-darms-paints/coat-darms-paints-fantasy-range/
Thirdly, is the current U.S.A. importer/distributor of the Coat d'Arms range; Scale Creep Miniatures.
http://www.scalecreep.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=2501_2502
Another good resource is the Paint Range Compatibility Chart posted at Dakka-Dakka.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Paint+Range+Compatibility+Chart
A more direct Compatibility Chart can be found at Hive World Terra, which in turn got it from a defunct page on Gladiator Games.
https://www.hiveworldterra.co.uk/Article/view_CoatDArmsConversionChart.html
Though it does not include all of the alternate names (exe: Titilating Pink) it is a chart worth reproducing here:
I've encountered a few other resources and perspectives scattered about the web, but thought to list these primary ones here.
CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG:
So, TTBOMK, Games Workshop began using HMG Paints Ltd. back in 1984-85 to supply their own brand of hobby paints. The original pots were round, soft plastic, with white vinyl lids, and had a generous internal volume of 20ml. In the early 90's, HMG were directed to change their bottle to the 17ml hexagonal design (probably for efficient warehousing and shipping purposes). At that same time, I believe Mike McVey and other GW staff contributed to reevaluating some of the color formulas. In the latter 1990's GW made the choice to drop HMG for a French paint company who introduced the (now notorious) Bolt Shell pots, made of hard plastic, with an even smaller liquid volume, and a penchant for allowing contents to dry out. Though matched to the previous HMG formulas, the new paints were also different in several regards. Since GW ended their contract with HMG, the line of original colors were renamed wherever copyright issues required, and the product line itself was renamed "Coat d'Arms". The "Coat d'Arms" line of paints use the same popular formulas as in 1985, and in the same 20ml pots, which provide a demonstrated history of longevity to the paints. Collectors regularly marvel at rediscovering long forgotten pots among their belongings, and often finding their contents as fresh as when first bought decades earlier.
What I do not know is the accuracy/reliability of the Dakka-dakka Paint Range Compatibility Chart, the consistency of the Coat d'Arms metallics compared to the original "Citadel Colour" product, or the "Coat d'Arms" Inks compared to the legendary original "Expert Set" Inks, which I understand was originally manufactured by another company.
So any first hand experience with "Coat d'Arms" vs. the original "Citadel Colour" range? Other useful resources? If this community contributes, this could be a very useful resource for other Oldhammer hobbyists.
My hope is that this thread can become an information repository for Oldhammer enthusiasts and the general hobby community.
I am very excited to collect a set of paint pots that match the original range as closely as possible, not only in color, but in consistency, longevity, and even smell. I am ordering several of the colors from the Coat d'Arms range right now, and even creating new old-style "Citadel Colour" pot labels with the original color names on them (Which should tell you how nuts I must be about this topic.).
I UNDERSTAND that other paint ranges could be used to emulate certain colors in the original range, but I'd like this thread to focus on the merits and possibilities within the Coat d'Arms range.
To begin with, I'll include links to some of the most important resources about these colors.
The "Archaeopainting" article posted on the Realm of Chaos blog back in 2012 is a definitive and indispensable introduction to this topic.
http://realmofchaos80s.blogspot.com/2012/09/retro-painting-and-modelling-or.html
Next is the UK business which currently supplies and distributes the original product as relabeled "Coat d'Arms"; Black Hat Miniatures. It is still manufactured by HMG Paints Ltd. in Manchester.
http://www.blackhat.co.uk/product-category/coat-darms-paints/coat-darms-paints-fantasy-range/
Thirdly, is the current U.S.A. importer/distributor of the Coat d'Arms range; Scale Creep Miniatures.
http://www.scalecreep.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=2501_2502
Another good resource is the Paint Range Compatibility Chart posted at Dakka-Dakka.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Paint+Range+Compatibility+Chart
A more direct Compatibility Chart can be found at Hive World Terra, which in turn got it from a defunct page on Gladiator Games.
https://www.hiveworldterra.co.uk/Article/view_CoatDArmsConversionChart.html
Though it does not include all of the alternate names (exe: Titilating Pink) it is a chart worth reproducing here:
Coat d'Arms
Product Codes.....................Coat d'Arms paint names.......Old GW paint names..............New dumbass GW paint names
101................................. White.............................Skull White........................White Scar
102................................. Black.............................Chaos Black........................Abaddon Black
103................................. Sun Yellow.......................Sunburst Yellow...................Flash Gitz Yellow
104................................. Blood Red........................Blood Red..........................Evil Sunz Scarlet
105................................. Flame Orange...................Fiery Orange.......................Not available
106................................. Enchanted Silver................Mithril Silver.......................Runefang Steel
107................................. Bright Gold.......................Shinning Gold......................Gehenna's Gold
108................................. Goblin Green.....................Goblin Green......................Warboss Green
109................................. Chainmail.........................Chainmail..........................Ironbreaker
110................................. Royal Blue........................Regal Blue.........................Kantor Blue
111................................. Dark Elf Green...................Dark Angel Green..................Caliban Green
112................................. Bone...............................Bleached Bone.....................Ushabti Bone
113................................. Magic Metal......................Tin Bitz.............................Warplock Bronze
114................................. Wizard Blue.......................Enchanted Blue....................Caledor Sky
115................................. Tanned Flesh.....................Bronzed Flesh.......................Not available
116................................. Barbarian Leather................Snakebite Leather.................Balor Brown
117................................. High Elf Blue......................Lightning Bolt Blue................Not available
118................................. Poison Purple......................Liche Purple.......................Xereus Purple
119................................. Rat Brown..........................Vermin Fur/Vermin Brown.......Skrag Brown
120................................. Hairy Brown........................Bestial Brown.....................Mournfang Brown
121................................. Bogey Green.......................Snot Green.........................Warpstone Glow
122................................. Elven Grey..........................Elf Grey............................Not available
123................................. Elven Flesh..........................Elf Flesh...........................Kislev Flesh
124................................. Dwarven Flesh.....................Dwarf Flesh........................Ratskin
125................................. Putrid Green........................Rotting Flesh......................Nurgling Green
126................................. Festering Brown...................Bubonic Brown....................Zamesi Desert
127................................. Enchanted Blue.....................Polished Blue......................Not available
128................................. Enchanted Green...................Glistening Green..................Not available
129................................. Vampire Red........................Crimson Gore/Red Gore.........Wazdakka Red
130................................. Bilious Brown........................Vomit Brown......................Tau Light Ochre
131................................. Brass..................................Brazen Brass......................Not available
132................................. Aquamarine..........................Hawk Turquoise..................Sotek Green
133................................. Ink wash - Flesh.....................Flesh wash.........................Not available
134................................. Ink wash - Green....................Orc flesh wash....................Not available
135................................. Ink wash - Blue......................Blue wash ..........................Not available
136................................. Ink wash - Brown....................Brown wash........................Not available
137................................. Ink wash - Chestnut.................Chestnut wash.....................Not available
138................................. Ink wash - Red.......................Red wash...........................Not available
141................................. Grey Primer..........................Smelly Primer......................Not available
142................................. Gun Metal.............................Boltgun Metal......................Leadbelcher
143................................. Dwarven Bronze......................Dwarf Bronze.......................Hashut Copper
144................................. Shocking Pink........................Tentacle Pink......................Not available
145................................. Ruby Red.............................Ruby Red............................Not available
146................................. Dusky Yellow.........................Bad Moon Yellow...................Not available
147................................. Burnt Orange.........................Blazing Orange.....................Troll Slayer Orange
148................................. Marine Blue...........................Ultramarine Blue..................Altdorf Guard Blue
149................................. Angel Red.............................Blood Angel Red...................Not available
150................................. Shadow Grey..........................Shadow Grey.......................Not available
151................................. Lupin Grey............................Space Wolves Grey................Fenrisian Grey
152................................. Scorpion Green.......................Scorpion Green....................Moot Green
153................................. Ink wash - Armour...................Armour wash........................Not available
154................................. Ink wash - Black......................Black wash..........................Not available
155................................. Angel Green...........................Dark Angel Green..................Caliban Green
156................................. Leprous Brown........................Leprous Brown......................Not available
157................................. Warlock Purple.......................Warlock Purple.....................Screamer Pink
158................................. Jade Green............................Jade Green..........................Not available
159................................. Golden Yellow.........................Golden Yellow.....................Yriel Yellow
160................................. Amethyst Purple ......................Amethyst Purple....................Not available
161................................. Deadly Nightshade....................Deadly Nightshade.................Not available
162................................. Nauseous Blue.........................Nauseous Blue.......................Not available
163................................. Beaten Copper.........................Beaten Copper......................Not available
164................................. Emerald Green.........................Emerald Green.....................Not available
165................................. Hawk Turquoise.......................Hawk Turquoise.....................Not available
166................................. Fester Blue.............................Festering Blue.......................Not available
167................................. Hideous Blue...........................Hideous Blue........................Not available
Product Codes.....................Coat d'Arms paint names.......Old GW paint names..............New dumbass GW paint names
101................................. White.............................Skull White........................White Scar
102................................. Black.............................Chaos Black........................Abaddon Black
103................................. Sun Yellow.......................Sunburst Yellow...................Flash Gitz Yellow
104................................. Blood Red........................Blood Red..........................Evil Sunz Scarlet
105................................. Flame Orange...................Fiery Orange.......................Not available
106................................. Enchanted Silver................Mithril Silver.......................Runefang Steel
107................................. Bright Gold.......................Shinning Gold......................Gehenna's Gold
108................................. Goblin Green.....................Goblin Green......................Warboss Green
109................................. Chainmail.........................Chainmail..........................Ironbreaker
110................................. Royal Blue........................Regal Blue.........................Kantor Blue
111................................. Dark Elf Green...................Dark Angel Green..................Caliban Green
112................................. Bone...............................Bleached Bone.....................Ushabti Bone
113................................. Magic Metal......................Tin Bitz.............................Warplock Bronze
114................................. Wizard Blue.......................Enchanted Blue....................Caledor Sky
115................................. Tanned Flesh.....................Bronzed Flesh.......................Not available
116................................. Barbarian Leather................Snakebite Leather.................Balor Brown
117................................. High Elf Blue......................Lightning Bolt Blue................Not available
118................................. Poison Purple......................Liche Purple.......................Xereus Purple
119................................. Rat Brown..........................Vermin Fur/Vermin Brown.......Skrag Brown
120................................. Hairy Brown........................Bestial Brown.....................Mournfang Brown
121................................. Bogey Green.......................Snot Green.........................Warpstone Glow
122................................. Elven Grey..........................Elf Grey............................Not available
123................................. Elven Flesh..........................Elf Flesh...........................Kislev Flesh
124................................. Dwarven Flesh.....................Dwarf Flesh........................Ratskin
125................................. Putrid Green........................Rotting Flesh......................Nurgling Green
126................................. Festering Brown...................Bubonic Brown....................Zamesi Desert
127................................. Enchanted Blue.....................Polished Blue......................Not available
128................................. Enchanted Green...................Glistening Green..................Not available
129................................. Vampire Red........................Crimson Gore/Red Gore.........Wazdakka Red
130................................. Bilious Brown........................Vomit Brown......................Tau Light Ochre
131................................. Brass..................................Brazen Brass......................Not available
132................................. Aquamarine..........................Hawk Turquoise..................Sotek Green
133................................. Ink wash - Flesh.....................Flesh wash.........................Not available
134................................. Ink wash - Green....................Orc flesh wash....................Not available
135................................. Ink wash - Blue......................Blue wash ..........................Not available
136................................. Ink wash - Brown....................Brown wash........................Not available
137................................. Ink wash - Chestnut.................Chestnut wash.....................Not available
138................................. Ink wash - Red.......................Red wash...........................Not available
141................................. Grey Primer..........................Smelly Primer......................Not available
142................................. Gun Metal.............................Boltgun Metal......................Leadbelcher
143................................. Dwarven Bronze......................Dwarf Bronze.......................Hashut Copper
144................................. Shocking Pink........................Tentacle Pink......................Not available
145................................. Ruby Red.............................Ruby Red............................Not available
146................................. Dusky Yellow.........................Bad Moon Yellow...................Not available
147................................. Burnt Orange.........................Blazing Orange.....................Troll Slayer Orange
148................................. Marine Blue...........................Ultramarine Blue..................Altdorf Guard Blue
149................................. Angel Red.............................Blood Angel Red...................Not available
150................................. Shadow Grey..........................Shadow Grey.......................Not available
151................................. Lupin Grey............................Space Wolves Grey................Fenrisian Grey
152................................. Scorpion Green.......................Scorpion Green....................Moot Green
153................................. Ink wash - Armour...................Armour wash........................Not available
154................................. Ink wash - Black......................Black wash..........................Not available
155................................. Angel Green...........................Dark Angel Green..................Caliban Green
156................................. Leprous Brown........................Leprous Brown......................Not available
157................................. Warlock Purple.......................Warlock Purple.....................Screamer Pink
158................................. Jade Green............................Jade Green..........................Not available
159................................. Golden Yellow.........................Golden Yellow.....................Yriel Yellow
160................................. Amethyst Purple ......................Amethyst Purple....................Not available
161................................. Deadly Nightshade....................Deadly Nightshade.................Not available
162................................. Nauseous Blue.........................Nauseous Blue.......................Not available
163................................. Beaten Copper.........................Beaten Copper......................Not available
164................................. Emerald Green.........................Emerald Green.....................Not available
165................................. Hawk Turquoise.......................Hawk Turquoise.....................Not available
166................................. Fester Blue.............................Festering Blue.......................Not available
167................................. Hideous Blue...........................Hideous Blue........................Not available
I've encountered a few other resources and perspectives scattered about the web, but thought to list these primary ones here.
CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG:
So, TTBOMK, Games Workshop began using HMG Paints Ltd. back in 1984-85 to supply their own brand of hobby paints. The original pots were round, soft plastic, with white vinyl lids, and had a generous internal volume of 20ml. In the early 90's, HMG were directed to change their bottle to the 17ml hexagonal design (probably for efficient warehousing and shipping purposes). At that same time, I believe Mike McVey and other GW staff contributed to reevaluating some of the color formulas. In the latter 1990's GW made the choice to drop HMG for a French paint company who introduced the (now notorious) Bolt Shell pots, made of hard plastic, with an even smaller liquid volume, and a penchant for allowing contents to dry out. Though matched to the previous HMG formulas, the new paints were also different in several regards. Since GW ended their contract with HMG, the line of original colors were renamed wherever copyright issues required, and the product line itself was renamed "Coat d'Arms". The "Coat d'Arms" line of paints use the same popular formulas as in 1985, and in the same 20ml pots, which provide a demonstrated history of longevity to the paints. Collectors regularly marvel at rediscovering long forgotten pots among their belongings, and often finding their contents as fresh as when first bought decades earlier.
What I do not know is the accuracy/reliability of the Dakka-dakka Paint Range Compatibility Chart, the consistency of the Coat d'Arms metallics compared to the original "Citadel Colour" product, or the "Coat d'Arms" Inks compared to the legendary original "Expert Set" Inks, which I understand was originally manufactured by another company.
So any first hand experience with "Coat d'Arms" vs. the original "Citadel Colour" range? Other useful resources? If this community contributes, this could be a very useful resource for other Oldhammer hobbyists.