So Which OldHammer?

portman

Member
Hi All,

I've started getting back into the hobby by collecting some 40K figures and some of the early rule books. However, I find myself wanting to get into collecting and painting up some fantasy figures as well (it's probably my love of history and Castles) and maybe learning some more about how the game works and some of the lore.

What set of rules would you recommend for Warhammer? It'd be good to have one with army lists in it like there is in the early 40K books - so I know what to collect. Most of all I fancy building some Bretonnia Knights.

(and as an aside - are there any Fantasy games you can play solo like you can Space Hulk?)

Cheers!

Stuart
 
You can play Advanced Hero Quest solo.

Regarding Warhammer, I myself prefer to play small skirmishes rather than proper battles, so I find Rogue Trader to be the most suitable rule set. It works just as well for fantasy combats as it does for sci-fi.

However, if you want to play proper Warhammer Fantasy Battle, most folks here prefer 3rd or 2nd Edition.
 

mubo

Member
Usually it depends what you can get people to play!

We've been playing slightly houseruled 6th, but have played 3rd. I prefer 6th, but YMMV.

I think it's more about going back to the 3rd ed way of playing rather than the rules themselves.
 

Zhu Bajie

Member
You want castles and knights and army lists? You'll probably get the most out of 3rd edition with Warhammer Siege and Warhammer Armies.

There's not really much 'lore' at that point, beyond an outline of world history, so I'd probably be watching Excalibur, Monty Python and the Holy Grail, and re-reading Marion Zimmer Bradley and T H White, but if you want the GW take on The Matter of Britain then the later army-books probably cover that.

I highly recommend just collecting whatever you like and building an army out of it rather than being confined to an army list - let the models and your theme define the army.

Solo fantasy games, Talisman, DungeonQuest, Advanced Heroquest, The Fighting Fantasy gamebooks are good too.
 

portman

Member
Thanks for the comments guys - for the editions and on the solo games. I'll probably go with the 3rd edition with the supporting books.

Zhu Bajie":1howq5f1 said:
I highly recommend just collecting whatever you like and building an army out of it rather than being confined to an army list - let the models and your theme define the army.

You are totally right of course, and as it's not likely I'll do much playing that's probably exactly what I'll do - sounds like a lot of fun actually.

I do enjoy reading the old rule books though and I probably get a copy as it's a nice to have - it's always good to know a bit of background anyway.

Zhu Bajie":1howq5f1 said:
The Fighting Fantasy gamebooks are good too.

I love those books! I used to have loads of them back in the 80's and have got a few now - they're great fun. What's really cool is my 14 year old daughter has taken an interest in them too. It'll be nice if that progressed into an interest in miniatures and gaming as well, as she's very creative and I think would enjoy it. She's certainly asked to give me a game at Space Hulk when I get it set up.

Cheers!
 

portman

Member
airbornegrove26":hidj3p7s said:
You could totally mix your Rogue Trader and Fantasy miniatures in a mixed siege games as detailed in Warhammer Siege. You can check out my post here if that would interest you: http://givemlead.blogspot.com/2018/03/m ... ci-fi.html

I'm sorry but it's got to be Brown sauce in a bacon sandwich - maybe with a hash brown thrown in as well! (I'm hungry now).

That's a great article (bloody funny actually) and a truly superb idea. I wonder how some WFB characters would fair against Genestealers in a 'Space Hulk Crashed into a medieval planet' type battle.
 
HAHAHAHA To each his own there.

Funny you should mention that. I just got my hands on a copy of 1st ed with Deathwing and Genestealer expansions....and I need to do a mission like that to resolve a scenario in my campaign. If you don't beat me to it, I should have that report up in a couple weeks or so. ;)
 

portman

Member
airbornegrove26":2cg67brh said:
HAHAHAHA To each his own there.

Funny you should mention that. I just got my hands on a copy of 1st ed with Deathwing and Genestealer expansions....and I need to do a mission like that to resolve a scenario in my campaign. If you don't beat me to it, I should have that report up in a couple weeks or so. ;)

I'm still painting my figures up so you'll definitely get there first! I look forward to reading it!
 

Brandocles

Member
I'd go with the awesome 5th edition rules. I went back with them and promptly got into Brets myself, currently 6-0, all massacres with them.

Only trouble is the hype thereof. Plays the best.
 
I prefer 3rd ed. It has alot of books to go with it, but the army book is just one book with all races in one place, its as balanced as any of the versions. Plus it has warhammer siege and realm of chaos. ROC are my favourite things. And its compatible with 40k rogue trader, basically the same rule set. Plus it doesnt suffer from the very annoying thing of too many special rules. Its just warhammer, that is move, roll to hit, roll to wound, armour saves. Its basic and yet full of stuff from the serious to the whacky.
 
Padre":1ej5su24 said:
All Warhammer is Oldhammer now.

I know you're joking but some people don't know the difference! :lol: In fact I'm beginning to think the term oldhammer is redundant now as no one knows what the hell it is and everything seems to be accepted.

ramshackle_curtis":1ej5su24 said:
I prefer 3rd ed. It has alot of books to go with it, but the army book is just one book with all races in one place, its as balanced as any of the versions. Plus it has warhammer siege and realm of chaos. ROC are my favourite things. And its compatible with 40k rogue trader, basically the same rule set. Plus it doesnt suffer from the very annoying thing of too many special rules. Its just warhammer, that is move, roll to hit, roll to wound, armour saves. Its basic and yet full of stuff from the serious to the whacky.

I want to like 3rd edition, it's my era and it's the only edition I played but if I'm honest I didn't enjoy it that much. It's a boring old historics rule set with magic and monsters tacked on. Every game was tedious maneuvering for a bit and then turn after turn of very predictable melee as units slowly whittled down one another in a very unsatisfying manner. AD&D Battlesystem though was far more fun. Combat was especially exciting in comparison to WFB. The Warhammer books are a great source of background material and ideas but as rule sets I don't think they really cut it, especially today. I'd recommend them for nostalgia but if anyone wants a fun rule set I think there are far better things available.
 

Zhu Bajie

Member
It's been a while but I found Battlesystem really clunky, needing lots of modifier checks, and combat was dull and deterministic without much fantasy flavour at all, Orcs didn't play much differently to Humans. The more streamlined combat resolution seemed to miss the cut and thrust of battle. I find Warhammers psych, morale and magic rules give a lot more depth and character on the tabletop.

Ultimately, preference in games really just comes down to personal taste rather than any form of objective measurement, maybe I should give it another go.
 
stone cold lead":2ytr9o22 said:
It's a boring old historics rule set with magic and monsters tacked on. Every game was tedious maneuvering for a bit and then turn after turn of very predictable melee as units slowly whittled down one another in a very unsatisfying manner.

Mate, that's just fantasy wargaming. :lol:

I (and my gaming group at the time) tried Battlesystem when it came out, but we just didn't get on with it, it just seemed too, 'fiddly', for want of a better word, so we all ended up back with 3rd.

WFB3 may not be perfect, but it was the least shite of all the systems we went through at the time.
 

portman

Member
Looks like I've kicked off an interesting discussion here - It's been enjoyable reading whilst I'm my hols so thanks for all of the replies.

One thought I've had whilst reading through the forums here is that Oldhammer doesn't just appear to be about the rule sets, but about the older style miniatures and the attitude of the gamers, And their happiness to break/adjust those rules and have a bit of fun in the process.

Would that be a fair assumption?
 
portman":os8rx92m said:
Looks like I've kicked off an interesting discussion here - It's been enjoyable reading whilst I'm my hols so thanks for all of the replies.

One thought I've had whilst reading through the forums here is that Oldhammer doesn't just appear to be about the rule sets, but about the older style miniatures and the attitude of the gamers, And their happiness to break/adjust those rules and have a bit of fun in the process.

Would that be a fair assumption?


Bang on, although I'm a bit jaded with the idea of oldhammer as a 'thing' these days. A few weeks of following the FB group and trading group and you quickly realise most people haven't got a clue what it's about. Gets a bit frustrating when people are posting everything but oldhammer.

Interesting how people found Battlesytem clunky. It was a breath of fresh air when I picked it up (on the strength of a comparison article between it and WFB in Games Master International). Part of me would be interested to see how I might fare with 3rd edition these days though as there were a few issues with gaming back in the day that might not have helped the experience.
 
dieselmonkey":193kijzn said:
stone cold lead":193kijzn said:
It's a boring old historics rule set with magic and monsters tacked on. Every game was tedious maneuvering for a bit and then turn after turn of very predictable melee as units slowly whittled down one another in a very unsatisfying manner.

Mate, that's just fantasy wargaming. :lol:

I (and my gaming group at the time) tried Battlesystem when it came out, but we just didn't get on with it, it just seemed too, 'fiddly', for want of a better word, so we all ended up back with 3rd.

WFB3 may not be perfect, but it was the least shite of all the systems we went through at the time.

Battlesystem 1st Ed.('85) or 2nd('89)? How about Battlesystem: Skirmishes? Other than what's mentioned on wiki page, I'm not familiar with 1st, but own 2nd and Bs: Skirmishes and both are about as complicated as WFB3, in regards to racial modifiers and tactical formations, plus it's better organized and included siege rules. Both the mass battle and skirmish books had rules for converting characters and critters from AD&D 2nd edition. The only downside was that TSR never properly supported it beyond a few miniatures boxed sets and a few supplements, like Forgotten Realms: Horde Campaign and Gold & Glory - my favorite obviously. :roll:

You want fiddly, try Fantasy Warlord...
 
stone cold lead":bh4n8wmr said:
portman":bh4n8wmr said:
Looks like I've kicked off an interesting discussion here - It's been enjoyable reading whilst I'm my hols so thanks for all of the replies.

One thought I've had whilst reading through the forums here is that Oldhammer doesn't just appear to be about the rule sets, but about the older style miniatures and the attitude of the gamers, And their happiness to break/adjust those rules and have a bit of fun in the process.

Would that be a fair assumption?


Bang on, although I'm a bit jaded with the idea of oldhammer as a 'thing' these days. A few weeks of following the FB group and trading group and you quickly realise most people haven't got a clue what it's about. Gets a bit frustrating when people are posting everything but oldhammer.

Interesting how people found Battlesytem clunky. It was a breath of fresh air when I picked it up (on the strength of a comparison article between it and WFB in Games Master International). Part of me would be interested to see how I might fare with 3rd edition these days though as there were a few issues with gaming back in the day that might not have helped the experience.
I thought miniature style wasn't the main thing associated with Oldhammer, but more about the rules and attitude... :|

The obsession with "retro miniatures" is probably why 80s Citadel sculpts are going for £10+ per figure.
 
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